I read your post about datamining and freedom and I understand, now, why you choose to use a handle instead of your name.

While I don’t agree with your conclusions, I do agree with some of the points you make, and respect your point of view.

Regarding cookies for tracking affiliate sales, the more I think about it, the more I realize how it can be a real “crap shoot.” It’s not nearly as reliable as I once thought it to be.

You bring up some good points.

At one point in my life, when I was younger and had more active brain cells at my disposal, I would have been much more interested in analytics than I am now. I try to use my stats to spot trends that affect my income so I can respond to them or switch to something else, but I really don’t spend a lot of time doing it.

I’m not trying to dissuade anyone else from learning all they want to about the subject; I’m just in a different place, these days.

Act on your dream!

JD

I realized I didn’t address your comment about talking to a handle. A disadvantage/advantage of becoming older and wiser is seeing the handwriting on the wall.

While I once did have my image and name all over the Internet I realized that was not in my best interest. So when I decided to let my old sites and blog expire and start fresh I did so without them.

Those who do not study history are destined to repeat it. There are numerous posts regarding privacy and the power of data mining in my blog. I linked the one with the most detail as the main link in this comment.

While it would be far easier for me to just use a name – or pick one out of the air – I consider this an extremely important issue so I do what I can to work around it.

An example bloggers might use to more deeply understand the first and last cookie issue is Thesis. I frequent at least half a dozen blogs that have a Thesis ad box. I have no doubt clicked on it many times in researching Themes.

If I decided to buy Thesis which of those many bloggers gets the credit is highly unlikely to be THE one that did the best job explaining the benefits and influencing my purchase UNLESS they use last click and I make a point of buying from THAT blog (if I even knew which one that was).

I have intentionally cleared cookies in the past in the hopes of giving the most deserving affiliate payment for their work. Hopefully that has worked; maybe it hasn’t.

As for analytics I guarantee that few know as much about as they THINK they do – including me – and those who REALLY do rarely write about it in a way that benefits the majority of users.

I will be doing more posts specifically for USERS who are not and have no intention of becoming analytics experts so that they will get the most out of their analytics and avoid the most serious and common mistakes.

I do encourage everyone to sign up for the free Mastering Google Analytics ecourse because it is a very simple way to get a clearer overview of Web Analytics. Even those who use it have learned about features they didn’t know existed.

That link is in the CommentLuv field and the privacy and datamining information are linked from my “handle”.

Internet Strategist´s last blog post..REVIEW: Mastering Google Analytics – Easy to Understand FREE eCourse

Serious affiliates would do well to offer as many opportunities as they can within the flow of their sites for potential buyers to click again and set them as the latest click.

Although this is true for the most part, and I know the “customers must see 7 times rule”, no one (ethical) really wants to have to FLOOD advertisements to be sure they’re last.

Dennis Edell´s last blog post..Do You Charge For Blog Reviews?

I’m also happy that Dennis introduced us. I’ve been reading your blog and it’s clear that you know a lot more about analytics than I do. I’m beginning to understand that affiliate programs are considerably more complex than many of us imagine.

“Having expired affiliates earning commissions benefits if they don’t pay them out to anyone else. They are bound to pay out more using last click.”

I think that gets to the crux of my objection to Aweber’s use of first cookies.

After reading some of what you’ve written about analytics, I’m happy that I’m not running an affiliate program from the merchant’s side.

At this stage in my life, I really don’t need that kind of complexity.

Act on your dream!

JD

I agree that, in many instances, a 10 year first cookie is going to result in nobody getting commissions for a sale and that has to be an advantage to Aweber, or any other merchant choosing this method of tracking.

Yes, newbies and people with smaller readerships are at a disadvantage with a first cookie, I believe.

I really don’t earn enough from Aweber to be very bothered about this. If it weren’t for the fact that I believe Aweber offers the best autoresponder service, I probably wouldn’t even have brought it up in the first place.

The only reason I remain one of their affiliates is because I believe in their product, regardless of the amount of money I have or haven’t earned from them.

I’m considering dropping out of their affiliate program and just linking to them directly when I promote them.

After having spent years testing their competitors, I’m clear on preferring Aweber’s service.

Act on your dream!

JD

Welcome to our discussion and thanks for your comment.

The scenario you describe could be valid.

At this point, I don’t think we’ll ever know and Aweber has already decided how they’re going to run their program.

Act on your dream!

JD

I’m glad Dennis mentioned your blog so we could read each others comments on complex subjects such as this one. I’ve done more posts recently on Web analytics.

As you mentioned, those who are sophisticated enough to send out follow-up emails and provide additional opportunities for the regular visitors to click again are more likely to be rewarded with last click cookies.

Because of this, the change is probably a good decision on eWebers part. Having expired affiliates earning commissions benefits if they don’t pay them out to anyone else. They are bound to pay out more using last click.

Serious affiliates would do well to offer as many opportunities as they can within the flow of their sites for potential buyers to click again and set them as the latest click.

As Web analytics matures there will eventually be better ways to track all visits and from the viewpoint of an ecommerce store that is more critical than most can imagine.

Online sellers who have affiliates, buy ppc ads and clicks from shopping comparison sites, and have strong organic listings can truly not tell what the source of their conversions really is.

I know one who was extremely dissatisfied with their affiliates because they focused almost exclusively on using discount coupons so every sale they were generating was a discounted sale that cost the retailer a commission too.

Internet Strategist´s last blog post..REVIEW: Mastering Google Analytics – Easy to Understand FREE eCourse

…After reading Aweber’s affiliate update and while I can appreciate both sides of the cookie debate, there appears to be a third (and a fourth) issue, that appears to be relevant.

…I never realized that Aweber used a 10 year first cookie, but for certain, a whole bunch of those affiliates were long gone when the sale was finally made.

…And if so, who received or is receiving the commission on that first cookie sale? … A good guess would be that nobody did or is.

…Even with a 1 year first cookie, a newbie stands very little chance of obtaining the sale after it is rolled out by the major players, while once again, the first cookie could very well belong to someone that is no longer around when the actual sale is made.

…It is a bit early for Thanksgiving, but you are going to see some massive “stuffing” as soon as the 1 year first cookie replaces the 10 year ones.

…Further, type in “autoresponder” in Google and see who the first two are and guess who is stuffing first cookies the most?

…I think Aweber and their clones are a good service, but I don’t like competing with the source that also makes the rules in their favor.

Dave…

PS: In all consideration, I am rather certain the last cookie sale is the best and most fair for all affiliates.

PSS: And yes, I think I will leave my website out of this one.

Welcome to our discussions.

I know what you mean about a tendency to get lost.

So, what do you think about the changes to Aweber’s affiliate program?

Act on your dream!

JD

Brad West ~ onomoney

Brad West´s last blog post..Check Competitor’s BackLinks

Welcome to our discussion. I appreciate your comments.

You raise an interesting point. Will doing a better job result in setting more first visit cookies? I don’t know.

What I do know is that most people don’t purchase on the first contact, which is why we want to use email marketing so we can continue to touch base, make additional points, and explain the benefits of a service or product, over time.

(As I’m sure you already know.)

It’s these additional contacts and the extra effort required that makes me prefer the last visit cookie.

I’m no expert in email marketing, but I’m learning, and I expect to be much better with it a year from now.

So, I won’t venture a guess as to why Aweber decided to use a first visit cookie.

I agree that affiliate marketing can be a great business, but there are downfalls, as well, that many people won’t talk about.

Yes, it is important to be choosy and to promote only the best products and services, not only for our businesses, but mainly for the benefit of our readers.

It’s a pleasure discussing these things with you.

Act on your dream!

JD

Back to the first/last cookie issue. I totally agree that last cookie is the best practice; but maybe this is a motivating factor for us all to make a more compelling sell at the first go-round!! Perhaps that is what AWeber’s goal in establishing first cookie credit?

Affiliate marketing is a great piece of the marketing puzzle and I think everyone who wants to increase their earnings should incorporate it. But at the same time, be choosy and find the best programs for your business.

Thanks again JD…a pleasure to be involved in your conversation.

Welcome to our discussion. I visited your blog and enjoyed reading several of your posts, so I subscribed to it and followed you on Twitter. I look forward to getting to know you better.

I do find it strange not knowing what to call someone, however. I like to talk to a person, not a handle, when I have the chance.

I have a lot of sites that are completely out of date, because they were built before, or during, the time I was caring for Mom before she died.

Things change over time and I learn as I go. There are promotions for things I no longer value nor want to recommend. There are ads for things that are earning no money. There are pages and sections that no longer represent what I think is important, so it’s time to modify or delete them.

I have a section of maybe 100 pages on one of my sites that used to earn me several hundred dollars per month, but hasn’t earned anything at all for nearly a year. It’s time for it to go.

Yes, the site may take a hit in the search engines while they reindex, but I’d rather have that happen than to continue to promote something I no longer believe in or want to recommend. It’s one of the problems of having some sites that are over 10 years old and which have been sadly neglected for the last few.

While the old stuff has to be changed or deleted, I’ll continue to add new quality content as I have the time and energy.

I’ve also found that I’ve spread myself too thin and I’m in the process of deleting whole sites to free up my time for managing what is working for me.

These have been difficult decisions to make, but decluttering is necessary.

As far as cookies are concerned, I agree with you that affiliate tracking does not have any simple answers.

While I may prefer a last visit cookie to one that registers the first visit, there really is no way to know who’s going to get the credit, for reasons you mention here and on your blog.

In many cases, the last visit may actually be the one with the first visit cookies, if someone regularly clears their cookies, uses a different computer, or does something else so that the visit prior to purchase sets a new cookie.

We really don’t know what’s going to happen, and that’s part of the downside of affiliate marketing.

It is the affiliate who takes all the risk, pays for promotions in terms of time, effort, and money, and may – or may not – get paid for all that work.

It’s one of the reasons I’m moving, at least partly, back into consulting. I always know who my clients are and don’t do the work unless I get paid. Up front.

Still, I really like affiliate marketing and I enjoy working at home.

We need to be aware of the issues and both the up- and down-side of the business.

I’m happy to see that you bring another voice of reason into the discussion. Thanks for your comments.

Act on your dream!

JD

I’m sorry; I didn’t see your comment.

I’m not sure whether a first or last visit cookie is best, either. That’s one of the reasons I’m talking about it here and not on the Aweber blog.

It’s good hearing from you, again.

Act on your dream!

JD